[Businessmtg] Show Of Hands

[List Administrator]

Laura, you are doing a excellent job. You have my full support. Please do not step down. 

Hugs

Sandie

Sent from my iPad

> On Sep 20, 2016, at 5:30 PM, Laura M <lauram at asp-afg.org> wrote:
> 
> If the rest of the business meeting is of Steve's opinion that I am doing a
> poor job, I will gladly step down immediately.
> 
> Given that I have received no information from anyone on the steering
> committee about how these business meetings run...and I am running them as
> I have seen the business meetings run here before.
> 
> Since obviously there are major objections to how I am doing my job, I will
> offer my resignation because that seems to be the only way Steve will be
> satisfied.
> 
> Laura
> 
>> On Tuesday, September 20, 2016, Steve Rankin <steve at serenitysys.com> wrote:
>> 
>> I agree with Jerry's assessment of "when" to have a show of hands.
>> 
>> The problem is that our current KBDM process does not separate the
>> FACT/INFORMATION phase of the meeting from the OPINION/DELIBERATION phase.
>> This is clearly seen in the current meeting where the vast majority of
>> posts
>> have been short quips of opinion, and very little fact & information.
>> 
>> We need to separate these phases of the meeting before moving on to
>> discussing a show of hands type of thing.
>> 
>> Hugs,
>> Steve
>> 
>> 
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Businessmtg
>> [mailto:businessmtg-bounces+steve <javascript:;>=
>> serenitysys.com at asp-afg.org <javascript:;>] On Behalf Of
>> Gerald Hunter
>> Sent: Monday, September 19, 2016 2:28 PM
>> To: Steve - SC
>> Cc: ASP Business
>> Subject: Re: [Businessmtg] Show Of Hands
>> 
>> Hmmmm
>> 
>> KBDM.
>> A general topic discussion is raised from which a consensus on a defined
>> topic is "detected". A motion is then written which fits that general
>> agreement. Full research and information seeking takes place regarding the
>> motion. Fully informed participants then discuss the motion until all input
>> is heard. Then a vote is taken with a goal of 100% agreement.
>> 
>> My question is this: at what point is this "show of hands" taken?
>> 
>> I suggest the only spot would be before the motion is written. [As in "How
>> many think we should write a motion on this subject?" Anything after that
>> equates to a vote on the topic without full discussion no matter what it's
>> called.
>> 
>> I'm in favor of more clarity on what we're being asked to raise our hands
>> to.
>> 
>> Jerry
>> - from the Hopper woods
>> -
>> 
>> 
>> Laura M <lauram at asp-afg.org <javascript:;>> wrote:
>>> Hi Everyone,
>>> 
>>> I wanted to give a little background of why this item is on the agenda.
>>> 
>>> ASP works by KBDM (Knowledge Based Decision Making). We don't use
>>> Roberts Rules unless absolutely a last ditch, as ASP wants to bring
>>> people to consensus before taking a vote on anything.
>>> 
>>> In a face to face meeting, the chairperson would be able to gauge where
>>> people are by looking at nodding heads, as well as listening to the
>> shares.
>>> 
>>> The problem at ASP is that the chairperson doesn't have the ability to
>>> gauge where people are unless they speak up.
>>> 
>>> Here is an example:
>>> An issue comes up in the business meeting and you are thinking that it
>>> is not a good idea and you share that position. You read all the
>>> shares, and realize that people have really good points, and change
>>> your mind, and wait for the vote.
>>> 
>>> At this point, the chairperson has no indication that you have switched
>>> your viewpoint, and would still consider you as a person who is not in
>>> favor.
>>> 
>>> Another example:
>>> You really don't have an opinion on an issue, and wait to hear the sides.
>>> You read everything and make up your mind, but don't share it with the
>>> group.
>>> 
>>> At this point the chairperson has no indication of where you stand on
>>> the issue.
>>> 
>>> What this all boils down to is that the chairperson needs a mechanism
>>> to determine how close the business meeting is to consensus on an
>>> issue. Since we can't do a physical show of hands, I am suggesting that
>>> we require a straw poll (or more than one) to determine if consensus
>>> has been reached *before *we entertain any motions that get voted on.
>>> 
>>> This will protect the voices of the minority, as well as ensure that
>>> everyone is heard.
>>> 
>>> Thanks for letting me bring this before the business meeting.
>>> 
>>> Laura M
>>> Secretary
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